Open Air Motoring with V8 Convertibles

Crew Chief Brad: [00:00:00] Our panel of break fix petrol heads are back for another rousing. What should I buy? Debate using unique shopping criteria. They are challenged to find our first time collector, the best vehicle that will make their friends go. Where do you get that? Or what the hell is wrong with you at the next cars and coffee?

What’s going on everybody? I’m Brad with me. As always, my cohost, Eric, we have a special guest tonight. We’ve got John from the Project Motor, and he’s also a GTM member. All right. As you might recall, we’ve mentioned many times before in this show, the constant debate within GTM called. What should I buy?

Not an HHR. And in tonight’s episode, we hyper focus on which V8 Convertible should I buy? So, John, describe your shopping criteria.

John Caffese: So, we were talking earlier a couple weeks ago, Hey, summer’s coming around, we’ve all been locked inside for COVID, maybe we’re not tracking so much, but what would be a fun summer car if we wanted to buy as a [00:01:00] toy?

So, naturally, All of us have coupes and sedans and we have their sports cars or anything So we’re thinking what is a good open air car to have now? Obviously there was a lot out there and we were kind of narrowing it down to v8s For more for the driver experience, the audible noise, our idea, our debate went into what V8 convertible could we buy or would we buy if we were in the market?

Now, a lot of questions arise out of that as far as price points, new or sold. And those are some of the things we wanted to get to and talk about and maybe flesh out here now.

Crew Chief Eric: So let’s do some clarifying questions here, John. Some of the most important being, does this need to be a manual car? Manual transmission car.

John Caffese: I would say, there is no requirement for that. I actually was thinking of some that are not, because that would be the buyer’s choice. So if this isn’t going to be strictly a track car, but just a toy car, a street car, just something you want to cruise around in, or if you want to beat the balls off of it at the drag strip or something, that would be buyer’s [00:02:00] choice.

I have a couple of suggestions that one actually is an automatic, others may have some as well. Not only is manual extremely rare in today’s new and even, uh, somewhat late model used car market. Convertible and V8, those are, uh, three, I don’t want to say dying breeds, but certainly three traits that are hard to find together.

Absolutely. So I think in a new car market, there’s maybe. You know, cars that are of that ilk and are less than 100, 000. I think there’s maybe four in the market. So, so

Crew Chief Eric: no, there’s no requirement

John Caffese: for

Crew Chief Eric: me. Okay. Okay. So my other question then is, could it be an engine swapped car where it didn’t start its life as a V8, but it can accept a V8 as a project car?

John Caffese: So I would say, I would add those to maybe the honorable mention list because I think the spirit of this car Is maybe not so much spending that much time on it I I think once we start doing engine [00:03:00] swaps the sky Is the limit as well as your money and imagination? So I think it’s cars that we can kind of turnkey go.

Okay, but I am interested to hear some of those ideas Because instantly, you start talking instantly, I mean, you could fit an LS in anything, so.

Crew Chief Eric: 944 convertible with an LS swap, right? I mean, like, let’s just.

Crew Chief Brad: Yeah,

Crew Chief Eric: right?

Crew Chief Brad: I can end this podcast right here, right now, with one, one car. Nissan Murano Cross Cabriolet.

Boom!

Crew Chief Eric: Oh, man! Right there. Good night, everybody.

Crew Chief Brad: Good night, everybody. I’ll talk to you all later.

John Caffese: So, you know, Brad brings up a good point. Here’s something I didn’t have on the list, but just, uh, your Nissan Murano makes me think of it. What? What? GT, GT Cruiser? Right? No, no. Any, you know what I didn’t have on the list, but it absolutely meets the criteria we’re talking about?

A Ford Bronco.

Crew Chief Eric: That was actually one of my clarifying questions. Did it need to [00:04:00] actually be a car or could it be a SB or truck of some sort or

John Caffese: truck a I think, I think open air motoring is open air mo motoring. Okay. I mean, if you wanted to have an aerial atom with the high boost of V eight in it, um, there you go.

Uh, that’s true. You could certainly bring that up. I don’t know if that’s a very viable car. You do have a price point though, right? What is your Right? So we’re thinking this is obviously not gonna be, or it could be a daily driver, but certainly not in the Northeast. It’d be difficult. I mean, for the more brave they can do that.

But that’s gonna, uh, include some tire swaps for winter tires, different set of wheels, and now we’re getting into different things. I mean, if the spirit of the car, is it to be a toy car, um, it’s generally gonna be a. Not primarily a daily driver or maybe a seasonal driver So I would say it’s probably going to be on the cheaper end of things So I would say most people for a first car, they might have a budget of fifty thousand dollars, right?

So just for argument’s sakes I was gonna say that’s pretty much the [00:05:00] cap. I think the realistic range here For the majority of the audience or just, uh, the public, if they’re getting a second or third car, that’s a toy, you’re probably going to be anywhere between 15 and 30, 000, depending on what your situation is and kids.

But I think anything with an asking price of 45 or 50, 000 market value, there’s going to be examples where you can find them for 35 or 40.

Crew Chief Brad: And just to clarify, who is the we in this equation? You keep saying we, we, we. Uh, just to see, is this with your, your, your dad or your, your mom or who, who’s the way, is it with a Rego?

John Caffese: No, I, I, I think, uh, we, in a conversation is, is mostly some of the, some of the people talking about the topics and trying to flesh out. I wasn’t sure if you were doing this with a group of

Crew Chief Brad: people.

John Caffese: No, no, no. So I think it’s mostly just some of what we were talking about before in preparation for this. Uh, and I think some of my suggestions are actually going to revolve around different buyers and I’m going to point that out.

Different cards for different folks for different situations that

Crew Chief Eric: might be better or others. So [00:06:00] so to john’s point, right? I think he’s referring to the gtm royal We and i’m going to put air quotes around that just to take a step back to clarify for the folks that aren’t on The what should I buy channel on slack?

I actually posed this question a couple weeks ago as you mentioned at the beginning of the conversation where it was like Hey, i’m already thinking about my next project car and I’m leaning towards a convertible or cabrio or vert, whatever you want to call it. But my criteria isn’t nearly as sharp as yours is because I’m okay with a four banger.

I’m okay with, you know, it doesn’t matter really the power plant. I wanted something fun, a little bit stylish, but I’m also a lot cheaper. So for me, I want to chop that last zero off of there and go, what can I buy for five grand? And then knowing, knowing me and how, you know, kind of anal retentive I can be about the build.

Yeah. I’ll probably end up being close to 30 by the time I’m done. I guess my starting price point is very different. So that was actually another clarifying question I had on my list was. Are you a hundred percent locked in to a v8 car? I mean, I want to have [00:07:00] this debate about v8s for sure But I want to know if I can pepper in some oddballs as we go along as a possible consideration

John Caffese: So I

Crew Chief Eric: had

John Caffese: I had a couple thoughts about that too Looking at the market a lot of the new cars are actually six cylinders or four banger turbo fours or even turbo sixes To replace the eight cylinders.

I think na motors in general with emissions and fuel regulations are dying So again, it’s going to really limit able if you want to buy new because if we’re talking up to fifty thousand dollars You can go buy a lot of brand new cars and then some It’s not two of them some of these I would say I certainly want to discuss the best options for that Engine be dams once we kind of flush out a little bit there because I think there’s a lot of strong contenders I was actually looking at a list of brand new convertibles for sale at dinner tonight And it’s not a lot of cars and I think it’s something like less than 20 percent of them even had a v8 So,

Crew Chief Eric: and very much to your point, when I was researching, I was just kind of, you know, doing the cursory cars.

com eBay auto trader stuff and just, [00:08:00] okay, start with just convertibles. Yeah, I got 3 million cars to go through, you know, that are available from, you know, 1900 to today. And then I started adding a manual transmission and a VA and this and that and the other thing. And by the time I was done, I was like, I got 500 cars to pick from nationwide.

So it really narrowed it down. And that’s why I wanted to make sure that. You know, your search criteria was a little bit more open to suggestion because that can bring in some really interesting cars in that price point that you, that you brought up and I know you suggested one this morning. So maybe we start with that.

John Caffese: We were talking earlier and I said, you know what I was looking at? I was kind of thinking about this and I said, okay, so. Here we are. We’re going to go in the very strictest interpretation of our own rules. So we have a budget of between 50, 000 or less. We want an open air motoring car. We want a V8, right?

So what is the purpose of this and why are we looking for it? Like what started the conversation? And the conversation was like, what’s a good driving experience? Outside of what we’re [00:09:00] normally used to cage cars or on track or right? So obviously convertibles or targa just we’ll call it open air motoring

Crew Chief Eric: Uh

John Caffese: a little more of wet noodles as a chassis not necessarily known as as sharp as some other vehicles Why are we like hung up on v8 for sound right?

We want that audible driving experience and the v8 pours out So when i’m thinking open air driving experience Back road bombing in the 40 50, 000 or less range. I said, yeah, you know what? How about a 1989 to 1993 94 I believe they ran up to 95 Ferrari 348 the 348s are in a weird spot There’s still a four valve motor before the three five fives where they became without last adjustments You do have to do the service out the engine out for the major but maintenance aside which you can skim away with It’s 300 some horsepower in your convertible or Targa It’s like 8, 900 RPMs or 8, 500 RPMs.

They absolutely scream. They sound awesome. Trill. Sounds like a bike or an F1 car going down the road. Very Miami Vice. I [00:10:00] mean, to this day, it’s not the most, it’s not the most prettiest Ferrari, but it’s certainly one where it’s quintessential Ferrari. It went away from the 308 and the fact that it’s got, it’s kind of like the baby Testarossa with the thing.

So it’s, it’s, it’s one off styling almost. The 355 after that went back to a little more classic lines. So I think the 348s are at the bottom of their price point much like a c5g will be I don’t think you’re ever going to get cheaper than they are now. You can get a driver experience quality car for probably between 30, I mean, it’s not going to be pristine.

It’s going to have 30, 000 to 50, 000 miles on it. But we’re driving a car. We’re not looking for investments, right? Here’s the problem with the Ferrari, right? There’s two types of people. It’s a Ferrari. That’s the problem with

Crew Chief Brad: the

John Caffese: Ferrari. There’s two types of people who are going to buy the Ferrari, right?

Especially with 348. One, someone who knows nothing about cars or wants a Ferrari because it’s a Ferrari and that’s what they can afford. So outside of maybe like a Mondale.

Crew Chief Eric: [00:11:00] I

John Caffese: just threw up a little bit in the back of my

Crew Chief Eric: throat. Yeah, exactly

John Caffese: They’ll go out and buy any ferrari they can afford because it’s a ferrari Now if you look at 308s 328s 355s, even 360s The 360 is a little more uh, uh, 355 with a rough life or history.

It’s about the same price as the 348 And 308s and 328s, or 348, ironically, they’re all about the same mileage, they’re all the same price right now. They’re all between 30, 000 and 60, 000. The cleaner ones are more, the ones you don’t want to deal with are less, the ones that are drivable and serviceable are in that range.

So literally any car you want to buy from 1980 to like 1994. You can get yourself a, uh, a Ferrari for 50, 000. My suggestion would be the one with the most horsepower and the newest and most modern chassis. Anyone who drives a 348 and reviews it says it’s absolutely amazing. Now, with that being said, let me circle back.

One, first person who buys a Ferrari doesn’t care. It says Ferrari. It sounds cool. It looks cool. I know nothing about the car. I’m gonna pay someone to do it. And I just want a Ferrari. That’s your buyer at 45, 000, [00:12:00] 40, 000. The second is someone who doesn’t give a crap about the prestige or the fact that it’s a Ferrari so much as the brand, as much as I want a car that’s open air handles, awesome, very European styling, mid engine screams, a lot of fun, small it’s manual steering.

There is no power steering on them. They’re really the big go karts at the time, because if you ever look at the

Crew Chief Eric: 348s, they’re actually really small. They’re an acquired taste, and I think you and I share that as the oddball that actually appreciate the 348s styling. Because it is I enjoy them. They’re very subdued, and I remember when the 348 Competizione came out, and I really liked that car because it was slightly wider.

You know, with the flares and the big wheels and all that. And it’s, it’s, I don’t know, it was the proper evolution because I thought the three 28 was such a letdown, you know, and we all fell in love with the three away because of Magnum and kids of the eighties and all that kind of stuff, but that being said, it’s still a Ferrari, right.

But I, I think we can give you some options. I mean, It does check all the [00:13:00] boxes, right? But there are a lot of other cars that check those same boxes and actually cost less and are less maintenance and less burden. Certainly. So you don’t casually

John Caffese: buy a 348. You seek it out. So either you want the drive, you’re all in on the driving experience and cost be damned, or you’re all in on the brand experience, cost be damned, right?

There’s no middle ground.

Crew Chief Eric: I

John Caffese: will agree with you. I would love a 308. I was lucky enough for my father had one I grew up with one I wouldn’t touch a 328 and a 348 even though it’s the same car is like completely different in my mind because it looks like a Little baby testarossa and a 355 used in another world as far as maintenance and performance.

But yeah, so I think I think if, if you were dedicated to have one or the other, Don’t you lose,

Crew Chief Eric: don’t you lose the gated shifter in the 355 though? It doesn’t, No,

John Caffese: so what you lose in a 355 that you don’t have in a 348 is the dogleg shifter. So they’re still gated and the 348 is 5 speed and the 355 is 6 speed.

So instead of having one and then two, three, you have your [00:14:00] traditional

Crew Chief Eric: one, two, your H gate. So not to diverge too far off because we could probably have a whole episode about Ferraris alone, but which one was the first one with the little joystick shifter?

John Caffese: So the 355 is a, is a transmission that, uh, debuted the, uh, the F1 transmission.

Yeah. Yeah. That’s terrible. Yeah. Eight up clutches. The 360 also had an F1 transmission. They got better, but it’s still very terrible. The 430, I believe like 95 percent of them were the, whatever version of paddle shift they want to call it. So if you find a 430, that’s an actual gated shifter. That’s going to be the big car that they’re appreciating value.

They actually cost more than a new Ferrari right now. And then the four, five, eight are

Crew Chief Eric: all on it. Now I’ll say this though. The three 48 I don’t like it as a convertible. That’s just a personal thing. I think I would not get a spider.

John Caffese: I, I, I love it as a Targa. I’m not a big convertible guy in general, unless it’s a hard top.

Crew Chief Brad: So Targa brings up another. thing that we can add. Are you considering Targas as the open air [00:15:00] experience? Some people say they’re not, some people say they are. So for your, for the act of this, for the purpose of this exercise, you are including Targas.

John Caffese: Yeah, I would because I think the Broncos and stuff like that would fall under.

Crew Chief Eric: Let me give you a counterpoint to the Ferrari. Like, I see the Ferraris too far out in the extreme. Like, I would never recommend that to somebody. In our group to say, Hey, you want a convertible to go have fun and take your wife out or your girlfriend or whatever your, your significant other or your dog.

I don’t care. Right. But the, but the point is like, it’s not a car. I would just foist on somebody that didn’t have the means to really appreciate it and take care of it. So the opposite extreme of that, because I was digging in and looking at the price points, Model A Ford, Ford Roadsters. There’s a bunch of those kinds of old hot rods that are actually cheaper than the Ferrari.

They’re a lot of fun. They make a lot of noise. Yeah, exactly. Right. But they’re also have the same problem as the Ferrari in the sense that you have [00:16:00] to be able to, to appreciate those cars, maintain them. They’re usually a hodgepodge or potpourri of like this Ford actually has a Chevy motor in it from like, you know, 1990 in a 1948 chassis.

You know, I’m just making those numbers up, but you understand from a dump truck, right? Yeah. But you understand what I’m getting at. Right. So You can’t, you can’t go into those cars blindly either.

John Caffese: Yeah, I’ll agree with you and I, I think I’m just going to rehash my point before. I, I think my example and now yours with, with, with the Model T or, or T Bug that I think is a fantastic example is that you are not casually going into that.

Like, that’s something that you’re like, Hey, this is what I want for any, any reason, whether it’s the cool factor or maybe you understand the engineering of it. So like you said, it’s either going to be a nightmare and you’re wrenching on it and it’s awesome. I’m like a factory five Cobra. Or anything like that.

Or you’re just buying it because it looks cool.

Crew Chief Eric: So that is definitely on my list. My plan here is we’re going to funnel towards like the ultimate decision and that was actually closer to the middle is a factory five cobra because of what it [00:17:00] shares towards you know a more modern car which actually brings me to my next point so if we start if we take the ferrari And a model a model T bucket or a T bucket and a Ford roadster as the outer extremes of this conversation and start to work our way way in.

If I’m coming at you from the left, the next thing I would tell you is 55 Ford Thunderbird, you can pick up for 25 K a Ford galaxy convertible and a Pontiac Catalina, all of those V8s. All of those manual transmission, all of them drop tops, uh, Packard

John Caffese: Caribbean. I mean, if you’re going into fifties or sixties, to be honest with you, that’s an entire generation.

I wasn’t even thinking about, I mean, they made just about one, just about every car had a V8 in it. And two, just about every car has some sort of manual because automatics were prevalent or that good. There were two speeds, maybe a three speed if it had a glide in it, but you know, a great, great. Yeah. I didn’t even think about that.

I mean, obviously any sixties muscle car. But yeah, I think those are cars to that. I don’t know if you’re casually buying. Uh, I think you’re seeking them out either for the fact that [00:18:00] it is a 55 thunderbird or you want that classic car

Crew Chief Eric: As you know, I watch a lot of restoration shows or what we call restoration shows And so, you know the care the care and feeding that goes into a lot of those 50s and 60s period cars versus the 70s.

You know, proper muscle cars is a little bit different. Like the owners of those cars, they’ve treated them with the utmost respect. They want to keep them as original as possible. If they do resto mods, they’re very tasteful. They’re very on purpose to keep the car drivable. Like the new EFI from Holly, which is a bolt on replacement for the four barrel car, a lot of the factory air conditioning, modern suspension.

where the car still looks and feels like, you know, like a Cadillac or a Thunderbird or whatever it was from that era versus, you know, I got a charger for 46 pack. My name’s blown and I got tails and, you know, flames and, you know, those cars are crazy and they’re great. And. they have their audience too.

But in this conversation, I guess we’re, we’re all kind of focusing in on a cruiser here. I [00:19:00] have a fondness for those, you know, fifties and sixties convertibles. And I think a lot of them for the money, they’re big value. And when you get them, as long as you don’t do the whole, bought it online without really looking at it and kind of, you know, knocking the frame rails to make sure they’re not.

They’re you know, they’re solid and all that kind of stuff. You’re actually getting good value for your money Because a lot of those those thunderbirds and the catalinas and stuff. They were running about 25k You’re talking

John Caffese: impalas. Uh in the 60s and 70s. They’re they’re in that price range some of the issues.

I see what that is So if you get one that you actually don’t have to work on, if it is any kind of original, or if it’s been restomodded to a certain point, you’re going to be on the upper end of the budget. It’s not over. And if you, if you are under it, you’re going to end up being over it.

Crew Chief Eric: And very much to your point, that’s why a car like the Barracuda, a Barracuda convertible or a Cuda convertible, because.

Barracuda and Hakuta aren’t the same thing. Actually, it’s, uh, But like a Hakuta convertible you’re looking at easily entry price of about 75k, right? So that’s why it’s not on the list. [00:20:00] I mean, I love those cars I mean, I love those old 70s challengers, but that doesn’t fit your search criteria. So that’s why they’re not on the list So let’s come at it from the right side from the modern side.

So we know the ferraris are on the extreme So what’s the next notch on the belt? Inwards from the right.

John Caffese: So I know you had mentioned one thing, so I was gonna let you lead that, lead that charge there and then wants to talk about as

Crew Chief Eric: well. I was gonna turn it over to Brad, ’cause I think he had an idea. If we’re not locked, I’d love to hear it.

If we’re not locked into v eights, I think Brad has a good one.

Crew Chief Brad: Uh, well, the Nissan Murano cross Cabrio is everybody’s dream, but they’re hard to come by. They’re very rare. Is

John Caffese: is that a VQ in that.

Crew Chief Brad: I think so. So it’s not, did they

John Caffese: put the 37 in it? So that’s got some power. Yeah, it’s, it’s

Crew Chief Brad: got

John Caffese: the, the prestige.

All right. Um, um, if you’re getting a Murano Cabriolet with a VQ, I’m buying an HHR and cutting the top off.

Crew Chief Brad: [00:21:00] If you’re thinking about what we’ve been talking about, he’s already got a project car right, sitting right behind him that if you’re just listening, you can’t really, you can’t really see it, but yeah, he’s already got a 60s Mustang that he’s working on.

He doesn’t want another project, so it has to be turnkey, correct? I being the four by four enthusiast, the off roader inside me and everything, I’m going to go a little different direction than what we’ve already talked about. Yes. Ha ha. Cross cabriolet. Great car. Everybody should get one. No, you’re not a true motorist.

You’re not a true motor sports enthusiast unless you own a cross cabriolet. I’m just going to, no, but I’m, I’m thinking, is it British? No. Yes. Yes, it is. Is it a jack? It’s not a Jack. It’s, I know I have, I have an idea. It’s a Land Rover defender.

Crew Chief Eric: Oh, hey, .

Crew Chief Brad: Actually pretty good. You can get a nineties 96, 97 ish, you know, land Rover [00:22:00] Defender.

It’s got the same feel as the, is like a Wrangler, but it’s, it’s not a Wrangler. So you’re not a, did you hear that? A Jeep Row.

Crew Chief Eric: Did you hear that awkward little pause in the audio there? That was the Lucas Electronics failing.

LS swapped the world. Buick 400, I think, in those things. Or no, sorry, smaller than that, but it’s a Buick V8, if I recall. In the 90s? Yeah, like Matt’s uh, Matt’s Land Rover, his LR, his Disco 2 is a Buick V8, so it’s probably a very similar motor.

John Caffese: I, growing up, we had a 64 International Scout, I mean it was a rust bucket, but we took the top off, and that was, so I, I totally get, and I didn’t even think about, we, we mentioned Bronco several times already, and I know we’re coming back out with it, but yeah, no, that’s a, that’s a, that’s a solid pick that I, I totally, in preparing for this, I totally whiffed on until we, we called, and I was like, oh, wait, wait, that’d be.

That’d be super cool. Um some kind of wrangler I want

Crew Chief Brad: I want one Just [00:23:00] because i’ve had wranglers i’ve had right. Well, yeah, i’ll do it eventually.

John Caffese: So how does the range rover? Discovery whatever model you said work you buy it for three grand you put 40 into it So you buy two

Crew Chief Eric: of them you buy two of them like matt did and you make one out of it

Crew Chief Brad: That’s the discovery the defender actually was a I mean the 90s defender was a pretty pretty decent model They were they’re very rare because they didn’t bring very many of them over here.

So that means they’re very expensive

John Caffese: If it’s older than 25 years old, we can import one rather easily But

Crew Chief Brad: it depends

John Caffese: on

Crew Chief Brad: what your time frame is too. This isn’t something you’re going

John Caffese: to

Crew Chief Brad: run out of the

John Caffese: dealership I think that’s As solid as that device is, I think we’re all falling into the trap is that we are enthusiasts.

So that is a full on, down the rabbit hole choice, as much as, say, the 348 or the 60s or 55 Thunderbird is. A fantastic choice. I think that misses maybe the spirit of the mainstream Turnkey of what we’re trying here because I think that would be a great love passion for you as much as the ferrari would Be a love passion for me [00:24:00] or those 50 60 errors for for that person So just shift it back a little bit towards some of our earlier conversations that led up to this I know eric had a couple things that he wanted.

Crew Chief Eric: Yeah So one of the ones from the right side and I need verification from you being a diehard bmw guy Was there an e92 convertible? Oh, he’s got it on the

John Caffese: list. He’s got it. I need to all right. So Hard top convertible v8 the only year with the v8 in it and it comes with an automatic the dct It’s actually pretty good.

That was going to be my counter to a car that you were going to say Oh,

Crew Chief Eric: yeah, we’re not there yet that that’s

John Caffese: That was gonna be that’ll be my counter that but uh, yeah, so An E92 M3 that comes with a six speed or a DCT if you just don’t even want to worry about driving it automatic. It’s got a rear seat that’s actually usable.

It’s a hardtop convertible. Since I had that written down, I checked some of the prices on them. They’re ranging anywhere from, believe it or not, like 18, 000 for a high [00:25:00] mileage one. So about 30 for a decent one, like any BMW, uh, M motor, especially from the E40 to Tom Ward. You got to check the rod bearings on them.

That’s a point of failure. Interesting fact, V8 in the E92, uh, the S65, which has eight independent throttle bodies, uh, is aluminum and actually 20 pounds lighter than the S54 it replaced, which was an M96. And they sound awesome. They get abysmal gas mileage. They’re like 19 on the highway. I don’t think any of us are

Crew Chief Eric: worried about mpgs.

If not, I would tell you to write the td

John Caffese: Certainly a car you can go down to the dealership and find one by buy it. There’s a million of them You’ll get financing on it. It’s going to be plush. It’s going to be comfy. It’s going to sound cool It’s going to look great They still look pretty modern and it’s super easy to drive if you want to carve up a back road you can I know BMW is kind of like almost cliche at this point.

It depends on who you are, but I think you could, I think you could acknowledge that, uh, anyone going down the roads and they go out to BMW convertible.

Crew Chief Brad: The counterpoint to that [00:26:00] car would be the SL

John Caffese: 55. Yeah. So let me, let me point to another. One on that list here. So that’s the s. That’s okay amg

Crew Chief Brad: No, no, no, but not the slk the bigger the bigger cruiser.

John Caffese: That’s certainly upclassing the m3 into like a six series So let’s

Crew Chief Eric: let’s bundle all those together then because I had on my list the f type Right, because those, as we know, Porsche Al just got a coupe and it wasn’t, it wasn’t hard to They made those convertibles. Yeah, they did. Then you have the S5 V8 convertible.

What was the one before the F Type? The XJ? Yeah. There’s, there’s The

Crew Chief Brad: XK.

Crew Chief Eric: The xk was I wouldn’t buy it. But yeah, it has a v8 You can kind of lump all those together You could also throw in the volvo c70 if you’re going non v8 car Just because of the hard top if you want to go all the way to the bargain basement on that You could go all the way down to the VW EOS as well, because it’s A GTI [00:27:00] convertible.

It’s RIO 3 53 70, those G 30 sevens, all those for me, just, they’re all just blobs of, of metal on top of wheels going down the road.

Crew Chief Brad: No personality whatsoever, but Have you thought about ’em? iata? ?

Crew Chief Eric: Yeah. Spoiler alert. The answer to this podcast is not Miata. You mean a Fiat 1 24? Yeah, I’m all for that.

Crew Chief Brad: Yeah.

John Caffese: I’m all

Crew Chief Eric: for a vintage

John Caffese: one. If, if we’re not racing it or tracking it, I would, I would take the turbo motor, uh, just so I can play with it and they make better sounds to me just cause turbo noises. I think to me, they come with a decent automatic now, right? And a hard top. So, I mean, certainly you can get in and go, I think a lot of people are going to shy away from how small it is.

If they’re just looking for a little, I say how small it is and I say little, but. I think what we were kind of lumping together as far as the luxury GT Boulevard cruisers. I think really that’s going to be the majority of the picks for the, Hey, I just want something to cruise around in. I’m not going to track it.

I want it to be sporty, but I don’t care if it’s [00:28:00] actual sports car.

Crew Chief Eric: Let’s still come from the right for a minute before I start going super vintage on you. What about the Camaro? The current Camaros Gen five, six, I guess they are convertibles and they came in a four cylinder and VA options.

John Caffese: Yeah, so they got rid of the six bangers.

Same thing with the mosse. My son had a four cylinder turbo and the coyote and the, the Camaro is doing that. You gotta be careful though, because they knew. A new Camaro, especially like the two SS or whatever the top level package is, is actually the same price as about a base Corvette. So you have to ask yourself, do I need the backseat or do I need all the extra bells and whistles?

Or I just want to have cool sounds and open air or the Corvettes are target tops, even the, even the base coupon. So that’ll handle better, be a better driving car, totally different market and segments, even though we see a ton of them out doing the same thing. But I think for a street vehicle. You’re talking something different.

And then two, that’s a rag top or sport top. So I think that’s a big point that we should probably discuss, or a lot of people are going [00:29:00] to go into it. It’s like, Hey, I want a convertible. I want open air experience, but I don’t necessarily want a rag top. So we need to get a wrangle or a Bronco or a defender.

You’re going to have soft tops and core tops you can put on it. Uh, even if you have a Miyata, you can have soft tops, hard tops, you can put on it. Me, I’m more of a hard top guy, had some rack tops, there’s a rack top sitting right there, and I hate them.

Crew Chief Eric: It’s kind of funny because I feel like the hard top convertibles are this weird way of trying to have your cake and eat it too, and it just For me, it doesn’t work.

If it’s going to be a convertible, you need to be able to reach up and throw the top back as you know, going down the road and not worry about, you know, all that other kind of stuff. Like even driving home yesterday from Summit Point, I saw a Bentley hardtop convertible and he was trying to put it up, you know, while he was going down the road.

And I’m like. I mean, I mean, I guess it’s cool, but like even those cars, like there’s all the convertible Bentleys and rolls and all those British cars, but they’re not on the list because they don’t meet the price point for another couple of years when the bottom falls out of them.

Crew Chief Brad: If you’re looking for, [00:30:00] it’s going to be your only car, then I can see the appeal to the hard top.

Cause you’re making a compromise,

Crew Chief Eric: but

Crew Chief Brad: if it’s like a third or fourth car, it’s going to be a toy. I don’t think anything beats a rag top. I just think, I think they, the right car with the rag top just looks cool. It’s just, they’re just great. Like Eric was saying, throwing the, throwing the top back at any moment.

Like some of them, they’re all manual tops. I hate to go back to the Miata, but like a Miata is just a manual top. You literally reach up, you unclip two things and throw it back yourself. I mean, I think, I like the, the rag top versus the, the hard top. Now, granted the SL that I mentioned earlier was a hard top.

I don’t think they had the rag top in that year that I was looking at. I’m a fan of the rag tops.

John Caffese: There were rag tops up until 2002.

Crew Chief Brad: Yeah, and I’m talking about the 2003s with the motor. Well, I mean, if that that goes into a different range now, but I was thinking the ones that they [00:31:00] used to race against the Terminator Mustangs all the time.

There were the forum debates about what’s better the Terminator Mustang, or the SL 55. That generation of SL 55 had the Supercharged. Yeah. Also

John Caffese: supercharged. Yeah, they had the E55 and all that stuff in there. So, I mean, the SLK AMGs Starting from the first ones were supercharged, but then in 05 or 06, they went to the 5.

5 NA V8, which is awesome. The downside, it was automatic only. But it’s essentially a Cobra, a modern day Cobra. Very tiny car, front heavy, big motor, lots of torque, super light.

Crew Chief Eric: Negative. Negative. Negative. The only modern day Cobra.

John Caffese: That’s a great point. So what can you get like a mid 90s Viper for now? So I looked

Crew Chief Eric: because, you know, I argue with Andrew all the time about this and, you know, he’s, he’s changing cars constantly.

He just got that Elise, which is also an open air [00:32:00] experience, right? With a very, it’s, it’s, it. You know, incredible cosmic power in an itty, itty, itty, bitty living space. But, you know, he and I go back and forth. I was there, I make it feel like I was in Detroit when it happened, but we were all of the age when the Viper was released.

And you saw Iacocca and Carroll Shelby on stage together with the very first Viper. And you’re like, What am I seeing? Like, what is this? This car is from Star Trek, right? I mean, it was, it was so modern until you boiled it down and realized underneath it’s a truck and it’s basically a Cobra all over again, you know, 40 years later, no assists, no ABS, it’s bonkers, but it’s a timeless.

Design. It still looks good today. You get a really well cleaned, maintained, even some subtle changes, like going to the bigger wheels on the gen one vipers. They just look fantastic. Right now, Andrew’s of the camp of the gen twos, I guess you are the Mercedes built, uh, vipers. And I’m just like, man, To me, [00:33:00] it’s like I’m looking at the front of a school bus.

I don’t like the big flat nose. I don’t like the length and the width of them. You know, there’s something to be said about that V10 though. You’re looking for sound. That’s hard to beat.

John Caffese: The thing is though, who’s buying that? I think that’s the same person that’s seeking it out. You’re seeking out the Defender, the 348 or the 60s thing.

So if I was the, you know, Joe Blow and I had. 000 to spend realistically, and maybe, or maybe even a little more like we talked about. Am I buying an early to mid 90s car that could kill me? Or am I going to go down to the lot and pick up that M3, pick up that E class convertible? Which is a rack top, you know that could have a v8 in it tough sell or I could buy a brand new Four cylinder mustang, but I know that’s why we were saying, uh v8 for the experience But that four banger makes more power than the 90s mustang anyway, especially

Crew Chief Eric: with the power pack.

Yeah, absolutely So the thing about the viper though is if you look at the price point of the targa [00:34:00] viper Which it comes with its issues, right if you really dive into those cars, they don’t have windows The door handles on the outside don’t exist. That’s why you really don’t have the one. You got to be able to reach in there to do stuff.

They’re quirky. They’re not fully thought out until they hit about 97, 98, 99. At that point, you’re already about five years into the, into the run or into the build of that car because the, the GTS coupe had come out. And so they made all these changes to them and they, then those changes kind of trickled down to the Targa until they finally got rid of the target.

Now, that being said, if you look at the price point value for money, I mean, you’re talking a nineties. You know, I guess it would be considered a really high performance sports car. ’cause it’s not in the supercar category quite yet. Right. Because now we have high performance sports car supercar, hypercar, and God knows whatever adds after that.

But you can pick up a Gen one viper for about 20 5K all day long. I search for ’em on the regular just because it helps my boyish fantasy. But. It’s one of those cars that for 25k [00:35:00] versus the Ferrari that we started talking about, I can buy two in, in, in comparison, right? And have a parts car if I needed it.

So for me, being a wrench turner, I’d be okay with it. And I kind of want that brutal experience that the Viper brings. Like, it’s like, come on, man, send it. I want you to try to kill me. Secretly, I want to learn to tame that car, but you know, we’ll, we’ll get there eventually. That’s probably a topic for another day, but I still think the Viper could be a contender, but it’s a very long reach for that everyday cruiser jump in and go have fun car because I think there are some maintenance issues there with the car longer term.

John Caffese: So before we go to, uh, into the weeds and we can talk about this all night, I don’t want this to run on forever. So it’s too long for anyone to listen to. I have three. Uh, questions I want to ask either of you, either of you, all of you. And then, uh, I think we’ll all answer it real quickly. So we’re talking about some convertibles and we brought, we brought up a two seat first, uh, four seat.

So what would be your preference, uh, or your [00:36:00] recommendation to someone who’s saying, Hey, I’m looking for a second vehicle convertible. And then obviously because the chassis that you’re going to look at, whether it’s a, a two plus two or just a two seaters different me, I’m thinking verbal, I’m thinking open air experience.

While some of the two bucks twos are in the SUVs with a choice. I’m going with a two seater.

Crew Chief Brad: Uh, I’m going with a four seater

Crew Chief Eric: Okay, and I guess I’m going with whatever suits my wallet at this point I’m not partial. I don’t really care. I

John Caffese: think you can find things that fit the wallet in either category How about Eric personally? What would Eric personally? So

Crew Chief Eric: there’s a difference if I’m recommending for you like I have something in mind that I think fits All the criteria, and we can talk about that towards the end of the segment.

But for me personally, if I’m just buying for myself, the Fiat 1 24, both new and old. Um, I’m a big fan of nine 14, but then I already have one. So it’s like whatever. I [00:37:00] like the nine 11 targets, but I’m partial to the 9 64, which is your 1989 to 1992 timeframe with the three six, I’m. Outside of that, I’m actually okay with the Mark 3 or Mark 3 and a half VW Cabrios, the ones that look like a Mark 4, and they’re actually not, because a lot of guys do VR6 swaps on those.

They’re a lot of fun once you get them straightened out, all that kind of stuff.

John Caffese: Even the backseat on that is tiny.

Crew Chief Eric: Yeah, I’m not but I don’t care. I can put the kids in the back still but I’m not putting four grown adults in that car Another one. I actually enjoyed driving. I got a chance to drive for a little over a week Uh while I was in san diego was a convertible beetle with the five cylinder As weird as that sounds that car checked all the boxes.

It was the simplicity of you know Crank the handle throw the top back plenty of power plenty of torque came in a manual Decent gas mileage. It was a great everyday car, you know, if it was just you so Missing three cylinders. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I am a big fan of [00:38:00] the 94 audi cabrio The one that looks like the coupe quattro, but they chopped the top off of it Which it is basically the same car that came with the v6 Sadly, it has a terrible automatic transmission strapped to it, but that’s easily remedied I think in addition to that the only

John Caffese: two or four two

Crew Chief Eric: seats or four seats Oh, I don’t care either.

I’m fine.

Crew Chief Brad: But let me clarify why I said four, since there was that awkward silence, you all were expecting me to say more. And I thought I was just answering a question, but anyway,

John Caffese: I

Crew Chief Brad: answered the question. That’s all I was required to do. But for anybody that doesn’t know me. I’m six foot four and 300 pounds, so most of the two seaters, I’m not going to fit.

I don’t care how far the seat goes back or whatever. I’m not going to make it. So I’m looking, the two plus two at least gives me room to put the seat back a little further. [00:39:00] Uh, and to go with what Eric was saying, you know, if I’m going to list some of the convertibles that are on my, my hot list, the defender, the Wrangler, uh, are the two biggest ones.

Cause right now I’m on a big four by four kick and I miss my TJ. Really, I, I miss it a lot. Uh, that, that’ll go into another segment, you know, and another podcast later also. Funny enough, I want like a seventies beetle convertible.

Crew Chief Eric: Yeah. The super bees.

John Caffese: Yeah. And,

Crew Chief Brad: and then I want a sixties Impala convertible.

John Caffese: So if, if size wasn’t the issue, Brad, let’s just say theoretically you didn’t have fit issues or the cars that you had, or you’ve been in two seats, uh, that you have fitted. I mean, what would your preference be? I think his preference would be to be six inches short. No, no, no, no. I don’t think, I don’t think that, I don’t think he’d give that up.

Crew Chief Brad: No, I want to be, I want to be taller. Um, no, [00:40:00] I, I, my preference is still four seater. Okay. So my second

John Caffese: question on the, on the two or three, I’m going to ask you guys, we’ll start with Eric. Um, of the, some of the cars that we’ve listed, obviously we’re talking about experiences and uh, open air has been a big thing.

And let’s go back to kind of why we pegged herself on, on eight cylinders. It was for sound so I’ll open it up to non 8 cylinders But of those things what would be especially the ones we’ve talked about but this way we don’t have to bring up something else

Crew Chief Eric: Yeah, so it would

John Caffese: be a motor that’s like hey, listen, that’s just got a very distinct sound I think I have some ideas where you’re gonna go.

Crew Chief Eric: Yeah yeah, I mean the first thing out of my mouth is gonna be vr6 just because You know, it’s in the blood. There are two other cars on my list that I didn’t mention. And they’re basically the same car, right? One is vintage and one is modern. The Carmen Ghia convertible, which I adore those cars, coupe and convertible and the TT, right.

And, you know, I already have a coupe, so it’d be kind of cool to have a convertible. The sound of the one eight turbo, if you get the right exhaust, something from maybe from tectonics or something like that, they actually sound really good. [00:41:00] The stuff we run at the track, it’s loud for the sake of being loud.

Right? So the VR has got a great sound, but if I had to really funnel in on a car, especially on eight cylinders, I’m going there, right? If I had to be reasonable about my purchase and say, I want something fun. It checks the box. There are four or five cars on that list. Fox body Mustang, because the five Oh back then sounds fantastic with the proper exhaust.

And I would actually venture to say the C4 Corvette convertible, even though styling wise, it’s, it’s, it’s still very Knight Rider and that’s fine. But the C5 convertible is another option because those motors sound great. You could also, Brad’s like falling out of his chair because I’m recommending a Chevy.

Crew Chief Brad: Nobody, nobody chooses the Barbie Corvette willingly. What the heck is wrong with you?

John Caffese: So, uh, clarify on the C 4, are we talking the Gen 1, Gen 2 small block, or are we talking [00:42:00] like the LT 1, the original LT 1? Which was still calculated as a small block, but it definitely had the crossfire in it. Ignition and that they do have a distinct sound

Crew Chief Eric: so I would usually defer to Mountain Bay and band to answer that question But in my personal case if it was my c4 Corvette I would probably ditch all that Have an LS2 in it or I would put a ZR original ZR1 motor in there right something like that because I can’t leave anything alone But to add to that list, factory five Cobra, like Andrew Mason has, that is definitely an option because I actually read it and they, and Dan reader and they come up on the list.

When you search like cars. com in that criteria that I said, manual transmission with a V8 convertible under 45 K. You can actually pick up replica Cobras for under 30. So I was like value for money. And you want to, if you’re building

John Caffese: one done, you can’t do it.

Crew Chief Eric: I’m saying buying one, buying one ready to go.

Right. So for under 30, it’s actually, it’s a car that gets people’s attention. If that’s what you’re looking for. It, it checks all the boxes. Now you [00:43:00] have to respect that car. And I will say they handle better from what I understand than the original AC Cobras and all that kind of stuff. Other two chassis cars.

I would hope so. And they have some advantages and modernizations and all that kind of stuff. So it’s a very much more tame car compared to the original, right? So that’s on my list, but I, you know, to kind of drive the point home again, being the responsible adult I have inevitably become, I guess, regrettably I have to argue for the S five 50.

Coyote powered mustang convertible.

John Caffese: I do like the way the coyotes sound. They have a certain spaceship sound to them that I just love I don’t know what it is. So brad, what would be a motor? preferably a va that Get your get your willies going the most of maybe something we talked about or that we didn’t That is an open air experience.

You would you would enjoy maybe it’s a really cheap

Crew Chief Brad: the

John Caffese: The 50

Crew Chief Brad: mustangs Are they, I mean, there’s nothing that sounds like them. [00:44:00] Uh, the five Oh Mustang convertible is just the early nineties, the Fox body, not, and then the. An impala a 60s impala with a big block.

John Caffese: Yeah a big block definitely has yeah That’s fantastic.

Like a

Crew Chief Brad: 454 496 big old cam

John Caffese: and yeah cam with like 800 lift and some something something

Crew Chief Brad: lopey You know, it’s got a nice little lobe to it But it but it’s not like too bad where it’s undrivable in the street. Um something with a little bit of lope and it gets 200 horsepower because that’s how the big blocks work, right?

So,

John Caffese: uh, uh, very I can smell the how rich it’s running. So it idles super 60s drag strip Like every shit you’ve ever been around, right? Yeah, basically so or if I just pulled, you know spark plug on Any modern v8 But I will say

Crew Chief Brad: I will say In current times like what’s going what’s out for sale now [00:45:00] and over the last say 10 to 15 years I don’t think there’s anything out there that sounds better than the mercedes amg v8s.

John Caffese: That is a hard

Crew Chief Brad: sound

John Caffese: to beat They definitely have a distinct thump to them So my answer is going to be kind of obvious my original then I got two or three Run the reps. So obviously any, the Dino style V eight Ferraris. ’cause in a four 30, it was a clean sheet. It’s not the, the Dino, uh, engine from the seventies all the way up to, I think the, the 3 55 ended in 2000 or 99.

99. So, but the 360 ran to oh five or oh four. Uh, and those were the last ones of those motors. So any, any any car that you picked there? Probably a 3 55. We’re 348, uh, 355 or the 360 specifically because they have the five valve. So they just the 9000 rpm They absolutely scream, uh people in my family have them.

You guys have heard it It’s ridiculously loud, but it’s so butter smooth It sounds like an f1 car going down the road now Not everyone’s can of [00:46:00] worms sounds like two motorbikes going side by side Sometimes it’s a little tinny a little raspy not everyone’s into that. I love it screaming. I just It sounds cool.

Uh kind of why believe it or not. I like the vq So the vq sounds very similar to that. It’s got that that certain how uh, even the vr6 has a very Rolling house similar to that. Yeah, it’s kind of you know, the vq and some of the ferrari motors are a little more. Uh, Shrill, which I like I will agree that the amgs have an awesome sound to it.

Uh, very smooth Um, but I will say that The newer Chevy lt. One motors actually sound different than the lss. I had an LT one and a C seven Corvette, and the thing that absolutely rustles my Jimmy’s is I remember in geez, 2014 or 2015, I was down at Daytona for the Rolex and the C seven R had just came.

And I’m listening to it go by and for some reason it can be in a pack of cars and I can hear that distinctly from [00:47:00] everything else. They just sounded like hammers hitting the ground. And uh, I really believe having, having one and having heard others, especially ones with exhaust at the factory LT cars, whether it be the new Camaro or the new Corvette.

Certainly have that very distinct sound different from the ls’s which was different than the small block More of the style brad was talking about the lumpy, but they’re still very smooth and they rev And I think they just they have a different base to them I can’t define it, but I think those that sounds

Crew Chief Eric: it just dawned on me john You’ve been talking about ferraris.

I thought you said fierro Isn’t that a target as well? Yeah, it could.

John Caffese: So, doesn’t have a V8 in it, luckily. Does have a V6. Can’t supercharge him. I mean, you can put a Ferrari body kit or V8 body kit on it. Fierro’s, listen, we’ve had a few come out to the track on the rated car. I mean, if you want to feed out 124, you get yourself a FIERA.

FIERA

Crew Chief Eric: X9,

Crew Chief Brad: right?

John Caffese: Yeah, right. Wait, wait, wait, wait,

Crew Chief Brad: wait. I interrupt this podcast with a special announcement. Oh boy. [00:48:00] Cadillac

John Caffese: XLR.

Crew Chief Brad: Oh God.

John Caffese: So that was actually the Northstar motor. It didn’t, so the Cadillac XLR, for people who don’t know, it’s a hardtop convertible. It’s a C5 underneath, even though it was around during the years of the crossover from C5 to C6.

But it’s a Northstar motor, so you don’t have to change the oil. For what they say, like a hundred thousand miles, they can go without oil. Like you won’t have it

Crew Chief Brad: long enough.

John Caffese: It wouldn’t go a hundred thousand miles before you had gas. My

Crew Chief Eric: big problem with the XLR is they took a C5. And ran it through the same software that they use to produce max headroom and we ended up with that car I mean like who designed that thing, you know,

John Caffese: I just don’t get it On one hand you have to look at the xlr and go what was cadillac thinking right on the other hand You have to you got to give credit to the xlr.

They were going where an uncharted territory and most importantly You’ll remember tim allen came out and was the one who announced this that was the first v car for cadillac

Crew Chief Eric: That’s

John Caffese: true. So [00:49:00] that launched their whole brand And the Cadillac XLRVs are supercharged, North Stars, and um, Supposed to be doing the same thing with that Blackwing motor, and then

Crew Chief Eric: And I know we’re supposed to be circling back to a conclusion here, which we will never I got

John Caffese: one more question for ya, and that one question, why don’t you finish, go ahead.

Crew Chief Eric: So, but I was gonna say, there are some other cars that we’re probably not even thinking about, like, it kinda popped into my head, the uh In in britain, it was the voxel insignia, which was sold here as the buick regal But the regal convertible if you’re just looking for something, I don’t want to call it run of the mill But if you’re looking at something somewhat stylish Reasonably priced you could pick up new that’s also another option and it does come with a six cylinder gm6.

I have uh, I mean You can, what is it, the

John Caffese: Cascada, where it’s a cruise? Yeah,

Crew Chief Eric: something like that.

John Caffese: I think the Cascada is an Eos or a Beetle, if they still made them, or a Murano, believe it or not, if you wanted to go that route.

Crew Chief Eric: But I mean, for the listening audience, I think we, as you mentioned, we’re enthusiasts.

So we’re always kind of thinking [00:50:00] German or thinking very high end American, but there are other options to this, you know, there’s

John Caffese: a, there’s a, what was it? The Toyota Solaris is a two door Camry, a drop top, fantastic car will last forever. It’s super soft. It’s perfect for a rental fleet and you can have that in your driveway too, for about 10 bucks.

That’s the truth, right? I mean, the oil change will be more than, uh, than the car and it’ll have as much personality as, um, your dead grandfather. So, um, so my last question I’m going to circle back is. You’re gonna have to pick uh, it’s somewhat of a conclusive one because even that’s going to take some time Of all the things we talked about we wanted to go Hey, what’s like a blue collar car that can go out with a max max max of fifty thousand dollars preferably less Convertible that had a v8 in it all the other options automatic two seat four seat suv [00:51:00] Whatever open air motoring v8, right?

That was our thing under fifty thousand dollars I think there’s two picks here for each person. So i’ll start with mine So i’m going to go with my enthusiast and which would also be my personal pick Which as we mentioned before it’s probably going to be any car from modena that you can afford that’s not a mondial Because that’s just terrible but you want to pick a 308 be magnum pi you want to pick a 328 and be silly I think the 348 or 355s you can find one of them price range would be a little more beat up But that’s really an enthusiast car checks all the boxes.

It’s open air sounds absolutely wicked It will drain your wallet as fast as it drains the gas tank though. So that’s something you just got to be aware of. But I mean, driver experience, which is what we’re like really getting at, driver experience, I think it’s second to none. And I don’t think you’re going to lose any money on it as far as the value of the car.

I think you’ll be in that car whenever you pay for it. I think, so I think the only money you’ll lose on that is the operating costs and the maintenance on it. Because if you buy a 348 today for 45, 000, you’re going to sell it in four or five years for 45, [00:52:00] 000. Uh, regardless of you brought 2000 or probably 15, 000 miles on it, which would be a lot.

I mean, that’d be three, 4, 000 miles a year, which on those cars are a lot. Um, if I were to buy one, I’d probably be doing about five to 6, 000, maybe 3, 000 miles on it a year. It’s about what I do in a toy car is now, especially with the street car. If I wanted to do something a little more mainstream, something that had Bluetooth, something that had heated seats, something a little more comfortable, or I just, Hey, I can.

You know, it’s a nice day out. I can drive it to work three, four days a week if I wanted to, I could take it to the beach, I could park it in the supermarket and go to CVS and not care about dinging it up or every person asking me a question, whether it’s a Thunderbird or, uh, an older British tank that’s going to get a lot of attention or a bright red Ferrari.

I’m going to go with the, uh, the E92 M3. Hard top. I can live with that on a daily basis if I wanted to. It goes up and down. The three series they’re they’re very plain in their execution so that they get a lot of uh, Rib, they get ribbed for that Uh, but that’s a good thing in this scenario because it’s not going to be a ton of problems The bmws have some [00:53:00] issues, but they’re pretty straightforward Cars been around long enough where a lot of the problems are easily solved.

It’s we’re not figuring things out anymore We know which ones to avoid. We wouldn’t know which ones to find Your wife could drive it. I say that in the sense that anyone can drive it. So if they don’t drive A stick, it’s not a problem. There’s a really good transmission there. It’s not just some slush box.

If you don’t want the rattles of a rag top, you’ve got the hard top. It’s a V8, it’s bad on gas, seats four, it’s got a nice trunk. I mean, you can drive across country with it. You can drive. Um, it’d be perfect one lap of america car if you want to do a convertible So it’ll go on track and go there and realistically they’re way under budget, right?

So you could probably get a really nice example for 25 30 and have some money left over if you had to spend that extra money If you had a 45 000 hour cash or check that you absolutely had to spend You could spend another five ten thousand dollars on the car making it your own whether you do some wheels or some suspension or whatnot but I think [00:54:00] Generally speaking the type of people that were recommending these two aren’t necessarily doing that.

So hey, listen save some money Get a cool car that looks a lot more expensive than it is because it’s still a bmw It’s still only last year’s bmw. The g20 just came out So really it’s only a generation old even though technically it’s two but most the general public won’t know that they all look the same And then you go from there.

So my my personal enthusiast pick would be Probably 348. I think the the run of the mill If I were to say, Hey, I want to look at a convertible. I wanted to be eight. I wanted to sound cool. I’d say, go get yourself an M92, M3 and my runner up, which we didn’t talk about would be any, uh, C5, C6, C7 Corvette that you can find in the price range with a target top.

You pick your styling. They’re all truck motors, which stop transmissions and do smokey burnouts. So just pick one that you like.

Crew Chief Brad: So for me, I’m going to break it down to off roader, low and slow, and just street cruiser. So for the off roader, [00:55:00] obviously I want to do a defender, like a 90s defender, or a TJ.

Uh, Wrangler with a motor swap, probably an LS one because they’re, they’re, you can, they can be had for relatively cheap and they, there’s all kinds of kids out there, you know, that fit right in for the low and slow. I’m thinking like a 60s and it’s a low and slow a and B. It’s a 60s Impala or 60s Lincoln Continental.

Nice. Um, the, the suicide suicide doors. I don’t know. I don’t know if a well, yeah, I don’t know if a well sorted one’s going to be in the budget. Um, those cars are pretty desirable, especially after entourage came out. So,

John Caffese: so a decent one is about 25, 30, 000. I know. Cause I, I look constantly because I love those cars.

Crew Chief Brad: Okay. So, so then, yeah, that, that, that ticks all the boxes for me also for just. Regular cruiser, drop top, turnkey, you go to the dealership, pick one up anywhere, the SL Mercedes with the V8, it doesn’t [00:56:00] necessarily have to be an AMG, probably without the AMG moniker makes it better for daily driver use. Uh, and parts are going to be a little bit cheaper because it doesn’t have the AMG tax and things like that I think the SL Mercedes of the 2000s the early 2000s I think those are my picks.

John Caffese: They like invented sporty convertibles the SLs in the 50s I will do

Crew Chief Brad: an honorable mention and it’s going to be a 50 fox body mustang of the yeah the fox body generation Sam is so proud of you right now. So

John Caffese: Brad, a T top Fox body or a soft top rag top Fox body?

Crew Chief Brad: Uh, I said Fox body Mustang T tops only look right on Camaros.

You know, the mullet’s got a flow in the wind behind you.

John Caffese: Oh man.

Crew Chief Eric: I love

John Caffese: me

Crew Chief Eric: an

John Caffese: iron,

Crew Chief Eric: but go ahead, Eric. All right. So I’m going to lead with my number one pick for anybody that’s looking for a turnkey [00:57:00] vert in the last four years. That’s gotta be an S five 50 coyote powered five Oh Mustang. It’s a handsome looking car.

It looks good. As a coupe, it looks as good as a convertible. And a lot of people say, no, it doesn’t, but I actually, I’ve looked at them over and over the silhouette of the car is fantastic. It doesn’t lose any of the appeal that the coupe has. It’s got all the same packaging, all the same, uh, you know, electronic stuff, all the creature comforts, everything you could ask for is in that.

Mustang, right? At the end of the day, that for me checks every box on the list and Ford warranty and everything else that comes with that. Right. And I could go buy one today. Unlike the M three where I have to go hunt for one, the Mustangs are more plentiful. They’re just, they’re everywhere. And the price point is well under the tip, the MSRP.

That you put out in terms of what your budget was. So I think, again, the Mustang comes in a variety of colors. If they made a GT three 50 convertible version, sign me up, you know, with that flat plane crank, you can’t beat that sound. I’m sorry. That would be 70 or 80, 000, [00:58:00] but you get my point though. Right?

So there’s a lot of things you can do with the Mustang. The other thing I look at is. I’m not a fan of the hard top. Like we talked about the soft top is fine for me, but the aftermarket following for the Mustang is also much larger than every car we’ve talked about here, there’s wheel packages, brake packages, stuff you can swap.

Uh, you want body kits, you want wings, you want, it doesn’t matter. You want bling it’s available. Right. So I also look at it from that perspective because everybody wants to. Personalize their car. The E92 M3 is an example. It’s a solid car. It’s a solid choice, but you’re limited to what you can do. And you’re also still running around in those kind of German circles of, if you can’t get the parts from Bimmer world or ECS is the only place you’re going to get the parts for him, right?

Ford. I can, I can get parts for that car and maintain it at every seven, 11 in every state, right? It doesn’t matter.

John Caffese: You can buy a Coyote from Walmart.

Crew Chief Eric: Right. Personal, like, this is the car I have to have because I’m having an absolute midlife crisis. There’s really three of them in [00:59:00] that category for me.

The Factory 5 Cobra, the Dodge Viper Gen 1, and the Fiat 124 Abarth, right? But that’s a personal, guilty pleasure. I’m losing my mind and I have to have a convertible car. All of those fit those price points, but if I have to stay true to my roots And pick a VAG product, I would get an S5 Cabrio with, if the manual is an option, I would do it with the V8, but I have to have the chains fixed, right?

And the chain guides fixed. Immediately. Right. It’s like a 911 with the IMS bearings and stuff, right? So what year did they switch to the

John Caffese: supercharged motor? The three oh

Crew Chief Eric: that well, 13. Yeah. B. I don’t remember. I don’t, I I’ve, I’ve separated myself from the B six, seven, eight, nine, 10, whatever the heck they are now.

Yeah. But, but I just know that, you know, those, those four, two motors, when they’re taken care of, they’re actually quite reliable. They make good power. It’s easy to get 400 out of them, especially if you do like an RS chip and stuff like that. [01:00:00] So those are

John Caffese: what? 8, 000

Crew Chief Eric: RPM, 85. Yeah. They spin pretty hard.

John Caffese: Yeah.

Crew Chief Eric: And the other thing is you can get them with Quattro so you can actually use it in the wintertime. So I see that for me, it’s also a four seater, a two plus two, uh, so you can use that even to cart the family around and use it as an everyday car, even as a convertible. So that pretty much, you know, kind of wraps up my thing, but I, I would still, if I’m recommending for somebody else, it’s really hard to beat that Ford when you really look at it compared to everything else we’ve talked about here.

John Caffese: I think the S5 is a fantastic choice. I know we didn’t talk about it much. Um, I’m surprised you don’t have one right now. I may, I, you know, hopefully I see you this weekend. You might be driving up on one that we flushed it out and realize how much sense it makes for you and your life. But, uh, no guys, I enjoyed it a bunch.

I know we could talk all night about this. Hopefully we can pick some other topics or get back from everyone else and see what they say. Thank

Crew Chief Brad: you for being on as well. We appreciate you. I

John Caffese: appreciate being out. [01:01:00] So as long as I’m around, hopefully I can, I can help you guys out.

Crew Chief Eric: Absolutely. And this is a lot more civil than some of the conversations go on Slack.

So I really enjoyed this. But with that, let me close with something real quick. I want to make sure the listeners understand, you know, uh, where, where we are on things here as a full disclaimer, GTMs, high level assessment of all the cars we’ve talked about is based on our member and ownership experiences.

And we urge you to do your own research and fact checking before committing to any one vehicle. GTM is not responsible for your satisfaction, happiness, or overall track experience. with the vehicle that you choose. Make sure to visit some vehicle specific online forums and or owners clubs for highly detailed and firsthand information on any vehicle you might be interested in.

Crew Chief Brad: Did John write that for you?

Crew Chief Eric: No, no, no.

Crew Chief Brad: He is the resident law lawyer in the group. The

John Caffese: consigliere, yes. I got one question for Brad. When you’re rolling in your five Oh, who are you listening to?

Crew Chief Eric: Oh, wow. [01:02:00] Snoop.

John Caffese: No, it’s gotta be Vanilla Ice, man, you’re cruising in your 5 0. No, I’m

Crew Chief Brad: cruising in my 6 4. My 6 4. Oh,

Crew Chief Eric: alright, Dr.

Dre. Double dub. And on that bombshell, I guess we’ll end it. Peace.

Crew Chief Brad: See y’all later.

Crew Chief Eric: You’ve heard us say it many times before. Without members like you, none of this would be possible. GTM also relies on its sponsors and partners in order to achieve all of its goals. We wanted to take a moment to do a quick shout out to all of our affiliates out there. Chazz has used auto parts, hooked on driving, AutoFab race cars, OG Racing, Battery Warehouse, Radial Tire, RLC Automotive Industries, Crutchfield Decals and Numbers, Brian Schad Photography, Auto Italia, Ultimate Outlaws, Breach Tech Solutions, TLCT [01:03:00] MotorWorks, and Fontana Web Designs.

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Crew Chief Brad: If you like what you heard and want to learn more about GTM, be sure to check us out at www. gtmotorsports. org. You can also find us on Instagram at grandtouringmotorsports. Also, if you want to get involved or have suggestions for future shows, you can call or text us at 202 630 1770, or send us an email at crewchief at gtmotorsports.

org. We’d love to hear from you.

Crew Chief Eric: Hey listeners, Crew Chief Eric here. Do you like what you’ve seen, heard, and read from GTM? Great. So do we, and we have a lot of fun doing it, but please remember we’re fueled by volunteers and remain a [01:04:00] no annual fee organization, but we still need help to keep the momentum going.

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